Dbol, deca, test. Second cycle

**Bjwatson83** · 07-31-2015, 04:57 AM

I'm about to start my second cycle. I'm 32 years old, 6'4" 233 pounds.

weeks 1-4 dbol 50 mg a day
weeks 1-10 deca 400 mg a week (200 x 2)
weeks 1-12 Test e or c 500 mg a week (250 x 2)

I have Armidex at probably .5 to 1 mg every third day. For pct I have armidex, nolvadex, and clomid on hand. I haven't decided the dosage yet but I have a month before I even begin.

I guess my questions would be
1- Do the dosages look right?
2- Should I always pin deca and test at the same time and same pin?
3- Would either Test c or Test e work better in this cycle? I don't have any experience with deca so was hoping someone could chime in on which test work better for them running along side it.

Thanks in advance![/SIZE]

**bulk_cut** · 07-31-2015, 05:11 AM

If it's your second cycle you should use test by itself again!!!!

You also really need to do more research/reading on AAS. 10 weeks is way to short to use Deca (~14 weeks is optimal), if you ever do use Deca (which you shouldn't - you should use NPP instead) then you'd want to extend test out 3 to 4 weeks past it. You should ALWAYS use Aromasin as Your AI and NOT adex!! BTW the Adex dosage you mentioned is ridiculously high!! Take HCG throughout every cycle and ALWAYS use aromasin during PCT and NOT Adex unless you really enjoy estrogen rebound and want to have a whole bunch of side effects and to feel like shit after.

Seriously, i didn't mean to be a dick.

**Predator1** · 07-31-2015, 05:37 AM

Originally Posted by bulk_cut

If it's your second cycle you should use test by itself again!!!!

You also really need to do more research/reading on AAS. 10 weeks is way to short to use Deca (~14 weeks is optimal), if you ever do use Deca (which you shouldn't - you should use NPP instead) then you'd want to extend test out 3 to 4 weeks past it. You should ALWAYS use Aromasin as Your AI and NOT adex!! BTW the Adex dosage you mentioned is ridiculously high!! Take HCG throughout every cycle and ALWAYS use aromasin during PCT and NOT Adex unless you really enjoy estrogen rebound and want to have a whole bunch of side effects and to feel like shit after.

Seriously, i didn't mean to be a dick.

Well put !!

**enrod** · 07-31-2015, 10:49 AM

I think your cycle looks good. Keep the arimidex low, I'd say your first option of .5mg e3d at most.

You very well can pin test and deck together, saves you from pinning more frequently. Doesn't matter here, it's up to preference. Deca is a slightly longer ester, but there's no harm in pinning it twice a week like test.

Test e or test c would equally be fine. They have almost the same ester length, but in the end they're both test. If you used test e before, maybe try test c this time and see how you compare the two yourself. Can help you down the road when making the same decision again.

Very moderate cycle, and I think you'll gain well off of it. I'm a big fan of deca brother, let us know how it goes.

**Bjwatson83** · 08-01-2015, 07:38 PM

I'm about to start my second cycle. I'm 32 years old, 6'4" 233 pounds.

weeks 1-4 dbol 50 mg a day
weeks 1-10 deca 400 mg a week (200 x 2)
weeks 1-12 Test e or c 500 mg a week (250 x 2)

I have Armidex at probably .5 to 1 mg every third day. For pct I have armidex, nolvadex, and clomid on hand. I haven't decided the dosage yet but I have a month before I even begin.

I guess my questions would be
1- Do the dosages look right?
2- Should I always pin deca and test at the same time and same pin?
3- Would either Test c or Test e work better in this cycle? I don't have any experience with deca so was hoping someone could chime in on which test work better for them running along side it.

Thanks in advance!

**bigsam** · 08-01-2015, 09:21 PM

Originally Posted by Bjwatson83

I'm about to start my second cycle. I'm 32 years old, 6'4" 233 pounds.

weeks 1-4 dbol 50 mg a day
weeks 1-10 deca 400 mg a week (200 x 2)
weeks 1-12 Test e or c 500 mg a week (250 x 2)

I have Armidex at probably .5 to 1 mg every third day. For pct I have armidex, nolvadex, and clomid on hand. I haven't decided the dosage yet but I have a month before I even begin.

I guess my questions would be
1- Do the dosages look right? Yes, they are perfect. Great cycle.
2- Should I always pin deca and test at the same time and same pin? Yes. You can pin them together in the same pin at the same time.
3- Would either Test c or Test e work better in this cycle? I don't have any experience with deca so was hoping someone could chime in on which test work better for them running along side it. Either test you choose is fine they are only one carbon different in their chemical structure.

Thanks in advance!

i answered above in bold......the cycle is perfect and looks really good.... there is a great post cycle therapy sticky in the post cycle therapy forum for your pct dosages and length. Start your arimidex at the .5 e3d like you suggested and go from there. happy cycling.

**suraonyx23** · 08-01-2015, 09:39 PM

Thats a good 2nd cycle. I like how your not going overboard with dosages. You should put on some nice size with that if your diet is in check

**bulk_cut** · 08-01-2015, 09:55 PM

You asked the exact same question yesterday and since my answer is still the same I just copied and pasted it

If it's your second cycle you should use test by itself again!!!!

You also really need to do more research/reading on AAS. 10 weeks is way to short to use Deca (~14 weeks is optimal), if you ever do use Deca (which you shouldn't - you should use NPP instead) then you'd want to extend test out 3 to 4 weeks past it. You should ALWAYS use Aromasin as Your AI and NOT adex!! BTW the Adex dosage you mentioned is ridiculously high!! Take HCG throughout every cycle and ALWAYS use aromasin during PCT and NOT Adex unless you really enjoy estrogen rebound and want to have a whole bunch of side effects and to feel like shit after.

**bigsam** · 08-01-2015, 10:18 PM

Originally Posted by bulk_cut

You asked the exact same question yesterday and since my answer is still the same I just copied and pasted it

If it's your second cycle you should use test by itself again!!!!

You also really need to do more research/reading on AAS. 10 weeks is way to short to use Deca (~14 weeks is optimal), if you ever do use Deca (which you shouldn't - you should use NPP instead) then you'd want to extend test out 3 to 4 weeks past it. You should ALWAYS use Aromasin as Your AI and NOT adex!! BTW the Adex dosage you mentioned is ridiculously high!! Take HCG throughout every cycle and ALWAYS use aromasin during PCT and NOT Adex unless you really enjoy estrogen rebound and want to have a whole bunch of side effects and to feel like shit after.

lol why only test again? obviously he's already ran one cycle why shouldn't he choose to try others now? he isn't doing some mind boggling cycle this is a standard cycle and the length and dosages are spot on..........never use deca? ridiculously high for arimidex at .5mg e3d? what the fuck are you talking about lolol i think that is a good starting point for dex and to be completely accurate with the dosage he should use only bloods can tell him and not anyone on here otherwise....... at .5mg e3d he can adjust accordingly......some people get extreme cases of estrogen and i know some that are on pharmaceutical grade at 1mg ed just to keep estrogen in check on cycle. AI during PCT???? didn't you just completely screw yourself on your cycle and pct with some of these other theories you had by not listening to people here?

this is a great cycle OP and if you are looking for more size, strength, and bulk you will get there if your diet is in check.

**bulk_cut** · 08-01-2015, 11:04 PM

Originally Posted by bigsam

lol why only test again? obviously he's already ran one cycle why shouldn't he choose to try others now? he isn't doing some mind boggling cycle this is a standard cycle and the length and dosages are spot on..........never use deca? ridiculously high for arimidex at .5mg e3d? what the fuck are you talking about lolol i think that is a good starting point for dex and to be completely accurate with the dosage he should use only bloods can tell him and not anyone on here otherwise....... at .5mg e3d he can adjust accordingly......some people get extreme cases of estrogen and i know some that are on pharmaceutical grade at 1mg ed just to keep estrogen in check on cycle. AI during PCT???? didn't you just completely screw yourself on your cycle and pct with some of these other theories you had by not listening to people here?

this is a great cycle OP and if you are looking for more size, strength, and bulk you will get there if your diet is in check.

You should really spend more time reading and a lot less time talking!! For one I have no idea what you're talking about as far as me not taking people's advice for PCT and having problems - I've been on TRT for years. Second, yes he should NOT take Deca and I don't think anyone who's not on TRT should ever take Deca. It has a ridiculously long ester and stays in your body for a long time and can make recovery VERY hard since it shuts you down hard. NPP is the EXACT same compound with a much shorter ester so it doesn't have the negative side effects of Deca and clears the body MUCH sooner making PCT much easier and increasing the possibility of recovery and is what he should use instead. Third, he's brand new to AAS and can/will still make gains off of a test only cycle so why should he use more compounds and put his body under more stress??? Just because you fucked up and did it that way doesn't make it right. People should ALWAYS use the least amount of compounds possible to accomplish their goals - and in this case test only will do that. Especially since I'm pretty sure OP hasn't gotten to the point where his diet is PERFECT and he knows how to tweak it to get more/better gains before upping his AAS use.

And just because I'm a nice guy and don't want you to continue walking around as completely ignorant as you are right now, I've attached an article on Aromasin and it's use during PCT for you to read and learn something already instead of trying to call out people like myself who clearly know more than you.

Aromasin Dosage for Increased Endogenous Testosterone Secretion and PCT (Post Cycle Therapy)

It is very clear that Aromasin can increase Testosterone levels in males as demonstrated by studies. One particular study selected 12 healthy young male test subjects, and were administered random Aromasin doses of 25mg and 50mg for a 10 day period, and not only was Estrogen suppressed by a significant amount (38%), but Testosterone levels in the test subjects were observed to increase by an incredible 60%[1]. Boosting the endogenous Testosterone production in men by an impressive 60% is not the only major benefit that Aromasin possesses. Aromasin also holds additional benefits that essentially make it the ‘king’ aromatase inhibitor for the purpose of HPTA and Testosterone recovery during PCT above all other aromatase inhibitors. The stimulation of endogenous Testosterone secretion is a characteristic common of all aromatase inhibitors and is due to the fact that excess Estrogen will cause a negative feedback loop response of the HPTA to initiate Testosterone suppression.

In addition to generating a considerable increase in endogenous Testosterone output, Aromasin also holds several advantages and effects over other aromatase inhibitors that do not exhibit them. For example, a common attribute of all aromatase inhibitors is the unfortunate effect of altering cholesterol levels in a very negative manner (reduction of the ‘good’ HDL cholesterol and increasing the ‘bad’ LDL cholesterol). This is due in large part to the drop in Estrogen levels, as well as the aromatase inhibitor’s actions themselves. Aromasin has demonstrated in several studies that it impacts cholesterol profiles far less than other aromatase inhibitors have, where in one particular study on cancer patients, 24 weeks of Aromasin (Exemestane) administration held no impact on cholesterol profiles[2]. Some of the same studies mentioned have also demonstrated a nil effect on cholesterol profiles from the use of Aromasin[1]. However, some other studies have displayed an alteration in cholesterol values from Aromasin administration, but that it was not as significant or as negatively impacting as other aromatase inhibitors[3].

In addition to the lack of negative effects on cholesterol profiles, Aromasin has also demonstrated in the same study that linkedAromasin to an increase in endogenous Testosterone production to also un-alter serum IGF-1 levels, which is something uncommon among aromatase inhibitors1. At its worst, it may lower IGF-1 levels slightly, which is a significant difference from all other aromatase inhibitors, and Aromasin has also been found to lower concentrations of IGF-1 binding protein-3 (a protein that binds to and inhibits IGF-1)1. This is all very good information to the anabolic steroid using athlete who wishes to recover efficiently and quickly during the PCT weeks following the termination of a cycle, as IGF-1 is very important for muscle gains. But the benefits of Aromasin do not stop there.

There is one issue with the addition of the other two aromatase inhibitors (Arimidex and Letrozole) in a PCT program that includes the use of SERMs such as Nolvadex and Clomid, which are known as absolutely essential components to a PCT program. The problem here is that Arimidex and Nolvadex both directly counteract one another. One study has demonstrated that when Arimidex is utilized with Nolvadex, Nolvadex will decrease blood plasma concentration of Arimidex (as well as Letrozole, another commonly used aromatase inhibitor)[4]. The conclusion here is that the use of Arimidex or Letrozole with Nolvadex together is a very bad idea and may work counterproductively if used together in a PCT protocol.

Aromasin completely circumvents this problem, as it has been demonstrated to have no interactions what so ever with Nolvadex, unlike the other two aforementioned aromatase inhibitors. In one study, Aromasin displayed no reduced effectiveness, nor any reduced blood plasma levels when utilized with Nolvadex[5]. Nolvadex is also very well known for reducing blood plasma levels of IGF-1 during use[6]. This might possibly indicate that Aromasin may assist to maintain stable IGF-1 levels or at the very least do nothing to further worsen Nolvadex’s effects on IGF-1. Therefore, from all of the information gathered, Aromasin and Nolvadex when utilized together for PCT are very complimentary with one another, making Aromasin the absolute best aromatase inhibitor not only for general use but also for HPTA recovery during PCT (or at any other time).

A sufficient Aromasin dosage for HPTA recovery during PCT would be 25mg daily for no longer than a 4 week period while Nolvadex would be utilized for a total of 4 weeks at 20 – 40mg daily.

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