Opinions and experiences on Short Cycles (4-5 weeks)

[LordKraven]

Shorter cycles seem like a good option for someone who is on TRT or blasting and cruising and seeking to things in a safer manner. You can even run 2 of these in a row and it’s still not that bad on blood markers unless you ran orals throughout both.

They are intriguing to me because a) shifts in lipids and blood markers are out of range for a shorter amount of time and to a lower extent then longer cycles, b) gains are at peak as myostatin has not kicked in to slow growth down, and c) personally for me, my training blocks are done in 5 week blocks. If someone wanted to mitigate the myostatin issue they either stay on their current dose until it returns to baseline or pyramid up the dose.

Anyway, I hear arguments on both sides, some saying it’s a waste of time to be on for such a short amount of time and that even short esters like Test P/NPP should be ran for 8 weeks or so to really get a benefit but having done 2 cycles (1st 16 week bulk, 2nd 6 week cut) I don’t have the experience to really comment on it. I assume 5 weeks is a good amount of time to put mass on if training, nutrition, recovery and proper selection of compounds are used, especially if GH and insulin were being used. Love to hear from all you guys, in particular those of who have run shorter cycles.

[Hatebreed]

I honestly like 16-20 week cycles where you ramp up but not back down. But I also like longer esters. I am also trt or basically blast and cruiz. But I think that by starting with a low to moderate dosage ramping up in 3-4 week increments I think it helps to an extent to counteract myostacin increases.
Just my 2 cents.

[LordKraven]

I honestly like 16-20 week cycles where you ramp up but not back down. But I also like longer esters. I am also trt or basically blast and cruiz. But I think that by starting with a low to moderate dosage ramping up in 3-4 week increments I think it helps to an extent to counteract myostacin increases.
Just my 2 cents.

How much time do you typically cruise for?

[Fancycat69]

Shorter cycles seem like a good option for someone who is on TRT or blasting and cruising and seeking to things in a safer manner. You can even run 2 of these in a row and it’s still not that bad on blood markers unless you ran orals throughout both.

They are intriguing to me because a) shifts in lipids and blood markers are out of range for a shorter amount of time and to a lower extent then longer cycles, b) gains are at peak as myostatin has not kicked in to slow growth down, and c) personally for me, my training blocks are done in 5 week blocks. If someone wanted to mitigate the myostatin issue they either stay on their current dose until it returns to baseline or pyramid up the dose.

Anyway, I hear arguments on both sides, some saying it’s a waste of time to be on for such a short amount of time and that even short esters like Test P/NPP should be ran for 8 weeks or so to really get a benefit but having done 2 cycles (1st 16 week bulk, 2nd 6 week cut) I don’t have the experience to really comment on it. I assume 5 weeks is a good amount of time to put mass on if training, nutrition, recovery and proper selection of compounds are used, especially if GH and insulin were being used. Love to hear from all you guys, in particular those of who have run shorter cycles.

That’s an interesting question man. I think it’d work better for cutting than bulking but that’s just my guess.I’ve done cycles for 10 weeks and have gotten great results.

I’m curious to hear others opinion on this and see what u end up deciding

[joko123]

I think it's a good idea in theory , most people stop gaining around the 8 to 10 week mark bc as you said that's where myoststin levels start to rise, so a 4 to 5 weeks hit and quit cycle would be perfect, less impact on your health , all the GainZzzzzz. Emphasis on gainzzzzzzz lol

It seems good on paper but through my past expiernce snd working either others you have to hold that weight for a decent amount of time, if you hast hard and then bring it down I think you're just gonna shrink down to how you started.

Now don't that mid cycle, I think you may be on to something.

I really don't have a clear cut answer I'm just thinking out loud.


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[Hatebreed]

How much time do you typically cruise for?
I know it goes against bro science and its probably not long enuf? But in all honesty it depends what compounds I used for my blast, and especially when I incorporated my orals. Some times what I do is run an oral them first four weeks waiting for the longer esters to kick in but if I reach a sticking point at say week 10 I might reintroduce orals again to break my plateau, it also depends on whats going on in life, work and gym, and how much time i can dedicate to me. But to give you an honest anwser no less than 30 days. I also like to cut a few weeks before a bulk so I get some of that rebound effect and good insulin sensitivity.
I'm sure others have differing ways of blast and cruiz but that's my method. I personally feel the best way to gauge if your ready for a blast again would be by blood markers. If everything has returned to normal you should be ready to go.
Just my 2 cents
HB

[350zsidewayzz]

I think it's a good idea in theory , most people stop gaining around the 8 to 10 week mark bc as you said that's where myoststin levels start to rise, so a 4 to 5 weeks hit and quit cycle would be perfect, less impact on your health , all the GainZzzzzz. Emphasis on gainzzzzzzz lol

It seems good on paper but through my past expiernce snd working either others you have to hold that weight for a decent amount of time, if you hast hard and then bring it down I think you're just gonna shrink down to how you started.

Now don't that mid cycle, I think you may be on to something.

I really don't have a clear cut answer I'm just thinking out loud.


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but i wonder if youd lose that mass if u were on trt and a caloric surplus still.
things i injectable take a good 2-4 weeks for the real gains to start, but if u ran straight orals. say m1t sdrol adrol all that shit. interesting to think about.

if it did work id think the 4-5 week oral route on trt would be faster

[LordKraven]

I think it's a good idea in theory , most people stop gaining around the 8 to 10 week mark bc as you said that's where myoststin levels start to rise, so a 4 to 5 weeks hit and quit cycle would be perfect, less impact on your health , all the GainZzzzzz. Emphasis on gainzzzzzzz lol

It seems good on paper but through my past expiernce snd working either others you have to hold that weight for a decent amount of time, if you hast hard and then bring it down I think you're just gonna shrink down to how you started.

Now don't that mid cycle, I think you may be on to something.

I really don't have a clear cut answer I'm just thinking out loud.


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So you are saying as long as you maintain your weight, don't try to cut. Right? There were some typos so I want to make sure I got what you were saying right. If so, I totally agree that it's best to maintain weight for at least a month before even thinking of cutting to solidify those gains.

[LordKraven]

but i wonder if youd lose that mass if u were on trt and a caloric surplus still.
things i injectable take a good 2-4 weeks for the real gains to start, but if u ran straight orals. say m1t sdrol adrol all that shit. interesting to think about.

if it did work id think the 4-5 week oral route on trt would be faster

I would rather save up and spend more $ for short esters/orals for 4-5 week cycles or 2 4-5 week cycles in a row. Imo waiting for esters to build up and clear is a waste of time where the body can instead be in normal ranges and recover in terms of health since PCT/natural production is irrelevant here. Time on = time off is a good idea for people needing PCT, but if you don't need it that becomes arbitrary. I am concerned with with wasted time on gear when myostatin is forcing to body to slow/stop growing. 5 on 5 off seems logical, however, 8-10 is very doable, but at that point idk if being off 5 weeks would be enough to lower it as it peaks around weak 8 and returns to baseline at week 20 -_-..

[Hatebreed]

I would rather save up and spend more $ for short esters/orals for 4-5 week cycles or 2 4-5 week cycles in a row. Imo waiting for esters to build up and clear is a waste of time where the body can instead be in normal ranges and recover in terms of health since PCT/natural production is irrelevant here. Time on = time off is a good idea for people needing PCT, but if you don't need it that becomes arbitrary. I am concerned with with wasted time on gear when myostatin is forcing to body to slow/stop growing. 5 on 5 off seems logical, however, 8-10 is very doable, but at that point idk if being off 5 weeks would be enough to lower it as it peaks around weak 8 and returns to baseline at week 20 -_-..

I think that what your saying about myostatin is subjective and has multiple facets to it build up and amount of time it will take to once again achieve base line levels!.
Just my 2,cents

[Diesel1965]

but i wonder if youd lose that mass if u were on trt and a caloric surplus still.
things i injectable take a good 2-4 weeks for the real gains to start, but if u ran straight orals. say m1t sdrol adrol all that shit. interesting to think about.

if it did work id think the 4-5 week oral route on trt would be faster

I think if one was to keep their food intake up as to match their size was at the time of coming off they maybe able to hold on to their gains to some degree because 1 of the 2 support system's are still being utilized and that is food most would take the approach of since they are not running anything they back off the food and I've seen that done many times even is Naturals if they quit lifting they quit eating they just regressed back to where they were at because they take the support system out.

[LordKraven]

I think if one was to keep their food intake up as to match their size was at the time of coming off they maybe able to hold on to their gains to some degree because 1 of the 2 support system's are still being utilized and that is food most would take the approach of since they are not running anything they back off the food and I've seen that done many times even is Naturals if they quit lifting they quit eating they just regressed back to where they were at because they take the support system out.

Actually, you can drop back down to maintenance calories and maintain most gains (that is maintenance at your new body mass, not previous which is a little lower), especially if you are on TRT. 150mg or whatever puts you in the upper normal range works just fine unless you are well past your genetic limit in which case a slightly higher dose would be needed at most. For guys going on PCT, well, have a good one in place to minimize loses and jump back to normal ASAP. Caloric surplus after coming off anabolics seems counterproductive because you already did all the growing you could and those extra calories will be storing as fat instead. As long as you are not cutting calories too much or trying to loose weight you should be able to maintain at weight at your new maintenance calories.

[Electromass]

Personally, I think switching up compounds is the better way to go here. So I voted 8-10 weeks but would run longer by switching or adding a compound. It's been show that this can amp you past a sticking point. You just have to plan a little more details on your run but I think it's worth a try....and yes I have done this myself

[LordKraven]

Personally, I think switching up compounds is the better way to go here. So I voted 8-10 weeks but would run longer by switching or adding a compound. It's been show that this can amp you past a sticking point. You just have to plan a little more details on your run but I think it's worth a try....and yes I have done this myself

I see, also with longer cycles a person won't be limited to short esters/orals only. How do you do you typically prefer running cycles your cycles, basic length, compounds, and when you add to switch to push past a sticking point?

[Electromass]

I see, also with longer cycles a person won't be limited to short esters/orals only. How do you do you typically prefer running cycles your cycles, basic length, compounds, and when you add to switch to push past a sticking point?
One of the simplest ways is to change from long esters to short on the last half of say a 10 week cycle. The run I'll be doing will be a bulk starting with all short ester oils, and adrol the first 4 weeks. Then I'm going to hit some sdrol on the last 3 weeks of the cycle, or if I see stagnated growth I'll start it then. I like the short ester change towards the end of a cycle because it's easier to "come off", or ease down to a trt dose.

[joko123]

So you are saying as long as you maintain your weight, don't try to cut. Right? There were some typos so I want to make sure I got what you were saying right. If so, I totally agree that it's best to maintain weight for at least a month before even thinking of cutting to solidify those gains.

Yes exactly what I was trying to say lol I am by far the worst offender with typos and not proof reading my posts


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[Electromass]

Yes exactly what I was trying to say lol I am by far the worst offender with typos and not proof reading my posts


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkYou're the worst offender?? With the pm I just sent you? ....you better take that back!!
Lol

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[joko123]

You're the worst offender?? With the pm I just sent you? ....you better take that back!!
Lol

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Hahaha that pretty bad


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[Boxsquatter]

I find it easier never to come off totally. The most i will do is drop down to 2-300mg of test to keep me the blood flowing. I ran a test deca cycle for almost a year a while back. The only thing i did was change up the mg every few weeks. Had great results. I can sometimes be a little unorthodox with my ways. But it works for me.

[Primemuscle]

Shorter cycles seem like a good option for someone who is on TRT or blasting and cruising and seeking to things in a safer manner. You can even run 2 of these in a row and it’s still not that bad on blood markers unless you ran orals throughout both.

They are intriguing to me because a) shifts in lipids and blood markers are out of range for a shorter amount of time and to a lower extent then longer cycles, b) gains are at peak as myostatin has not kicked in to slow growth down, and c) personally for me, my training blocks are done in 5 week blocks. If someone wanted to mitigate the myostatin issue they either stay on their current dose until it returns to baseline or pyramid up the dose.

Anyway, I hear arguments on both sides, some saying it’s a waste of time to be on for such a short amount of time and that even short esters like Test P/NPP should be ran for 8 weeks or so to really get a benefit but having done 2 cycles (1st 16 week bulk, 2nd 6 week cut) I don’t have the experience to really comment on it. I assume 5 weeks is a good amount of time to put mass on if training, nutrition, recovery and proper selection of compounds are used, especially if GH and insulin were being used. Love to hear from all you guys, in particular those of who have run shorter cycles.

I think 6-8 weeks shorter runs can be beneficial if diet/supplements/nutrient timing and training are all dialed in then going on trt while upping calories you could definitely make/maintain and then gain more on the trt with a spot on diet. Did something fairly similar last year and got up to 246lbs with 11% body fat just on trt/gh and building up to 6k calories.

I always say the gear doesn’t work unless you do. And more isn’t always more. So with low to moderate doses with spot on nutrition, supplements & training you can make some great gains. It’s a year round thing so if you’re always fine tuning and training hard you’re body will respond and grow


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[LordKraven]

I think 6-8 weeks shorter runs can be beneficial if diet/supplements/nutrient timing and training are all dialed in then going on trt while upping calories you could definitely make/maintain and then gain more on the trt with a spot on diet. Did something fairly similar last year and got up to 246lbs with 11% body fat just on trt/gh and building up to 6k calories.

I always say the gear doesn’t work unless you do. And more isn’t always more. So with low to moderate doses with spot on nutrition, supplements & training you can make some great gains. It’s a year round thing so if you’re always fine tuning and training hard you’re body will respond and grow


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That is very impressive. What was your "TRT" and GH dose and was it generic GH?

[LordKraven]

One of the simplest ways is to change from long esters to short on the last half of say a 10 week cycle. The run I'll be doing will be a bulk starting with all short ester oils, and adrol the first 4 weeks. Then I'm going to hit some sdrol on the last 3 weeks of the cycle, or if I see stagnated growth I'll start it then. I like the short ester change towards the end of a cycle because it's easier to "come off", or ease down to a trt dose.

So your next bulk will look something like this?

Week 1-10 Short Esters
Week 1-4 Adrol
Week 8-10 Sdrol

I had given thought to starting with long ester and switching to short but am on the fence on whether to stick to short esters the whole cycle or switch like you said. My next run is shaping up to look something like the following:

Week 1-10 @400-500mg Test/350mg NPP
Week 8-10 @Sdrol 10-20mg

NPP would be constant, where as the Test would either be Test E and switching to Test P later in the cycle or constant dose of Test P the whole time. Would there be any advantage of running one over the other? My main area of confusion is when people say switch the compound or up the dose every 6 weeks or so. Is that because as AAS concentrations increase steadily you grow and once it stagnates for a couple weeks you platue? Such as running a constant dose of Test P/NPP vs Test E/NPP where the test slowly rises over the weeks. I hope that made sense. If not let me know and i'll gladly rephrase.

[Electromass]

So your next bulk will look something like this?

Week 1-10 Short Esters
Week 1-4 Adrol
Week 8-10 Sdrol

I had given thought to starting with long ester and switching to short but am on the fence on whether to stick to short esters the whole cycle or switch like you said. My next run is shaping up to look something like the following:

Week 1-10 @400-500mg Test/350mg NPP
Week 8-10 @Sdrol 10-20mg

NPP would be constant, where as the Test would either be Test E and switching to Test P later in the cycle or constant dose of Test P the whole time. Would there be any advantage of running one over the other? My main area of confusion is when people say switch the compound or up the dose every 6 weeks or so. Is that because as AAS concentrations increase steadily you grow and once it stagnates for a couple weeks you platue? Such as running a constant dose of Test P/NPP vs Test E/NPP where the test slowly rises over the weeks. I hope that made sense. If not let me know and i'll gladly rephrase.Yes, it makes sense but...the test depends on if you are coming completely off, or just going down to a trt schedule. If you are Coming down to a trt dosage then I would stay on the the test e or c. No need to switch back and forth twice. Tren is something you can rotate in and out. Npp, or mast p are also good choices, but you have to be familiar with the interaction and timing to make the most out of each compound. These are key areas where knowledge is going to be your best friend.

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[LordKraven]

Yes, it makes sense but...the test depends on if you are coming completely off, or just going down to a trt schedule. If you are Coming down to a trt dosage then I would stay on the the test e or c. No need to switch back and forth twice. Tren is something you can rotate in and out. Npp, or mast p are also good choices, but you have to be familiar with the interaction and timing to make the most out of each compound. These are key areas where knowledge is going to be your best friend.

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Well, my TRT dose is 150mg Test E and I was going to pin it just the same throughout the cycle. The only difference on a blast was going to be either 100mg Test P/100mg NPP EOD or more Test E with 100mg NPP EOD. Either way it would total 500 Test/350 NPP, but if one offers a benefit over the other I'd prefer doing that one since I already have the compounds on hand. Homebrewing FTW! Thanks for your input by the, it's real helpful!

[Electromass]

Well, my TRT dose is 150mg Test E and I was going to pin it just the same throughout the cycle. The only difference on a blast was going to be either 100mg Test P/100mg NPP EOD or more Test E with 100mg NPP EOD. Either way it would total 500 Test/350 NPP, but if one offers a benefit over the other I'd prefer doing that one since I already have the compounds on hand. Homebrewing FTW! Thanks for your input by the, it's real helpful!
No problem bro, I have actually done the test e to test p switch before and I was amazed at how my body responded.
So I started looking closer at which compounds would be the best to get a response from as gains slow down. The ol' trial and error thing. Now, it still applies that "what may work great for some may not for others" but it's worth experimenting with.

[Primemuscle]

That is very impressive. What was your "TRT" and GH dose and was it generic GH?

Thank you man appreciate that.

Trt dose was 250mg so what I did was half cc Monday and half cc Thursday to get that total just so I would have stable blood levels and not peak and crash. Ran gh at 3-4ius generic.

Honestly I always say the drugs don’t work unless you do. Ppl use way too much and it’s just a overkill. Look at Lee Preist. One of the most incredible physiques and he said he always used low to moderate gear and focused on very hard on diet. Now before someone uses the ‘genetics’ card again those only are applicable when you work hard. There’s people with sub par genetics who bust their ass day in and day out in the gym with moderate doses of gear at most but have spot on diet/supplement/nutrient timing and get phenomenal results.

Sorry if that was tmi but figured I throw some 2 cents in there.


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[LordKraven]

I find it easier never to come off totally. The most i will do is drop down to 2-300mg of test to keep me the blood flowing. I ran a test deca cycle for almost a year a while back. The only thing i did was change up the mg every few weeks. Had great results. I can sometimes be a little unorthodox with my ways. But it works for me.

200-300 is what most run for TRT. When you ran that cycle for the year what dosages did you start and end with and end with for Test/Deca? Like 1cc and you up it 1/2 a cc of each every month? Interested to hear how you incrementally increased the dose and saw results because it looks like it would quickly pyramid up.

[babybull34]

Personally, I think switching up compounds is the better way to go here. So I voted 8-10 weeks but would run longer by switching or adding a compound. It's been show that this can amp you past a sticking point. You just have to plan a little more details on your run but I think it's worth a try....and yes I have done this myself

^^^^^ This right here is hat I learned worked for me. When I do long cycles (16-20 weeks) it is with gentle compounds: primo, low test, low eq, low deca, for slow constant progress. When I use to turn up the volume with higher mgs and go for as much mass as possible I would switch compounds around the 8 to 10 week mark. Always gave me the best results this way.