How-to Post Cycle Therapy Everything you need to know

[AllAboutPeptides]

How-to Post Cycle Therapy


Everything you need to know


http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q648/allaboutpeptides/PostCycleTherapy_zps76e78f50.jpg



Post cycle therapy is the period of time after your cycle is over in which the main goal is to restore your bodiless natural functions including normal and natural hormone levels. This is done through a few different drugs.




Aromatase Inhibitor


First we need an AI to avoid any amortizing estrogen that may come from the esters that are still clearing and also from the HcG we will be taking the first two weeks of the PCT. This will keep your estrogen levels in check while also helping restore your natural testosterone levels. Some popular AI’s are: Aromasin(exemestane), Arimidex(anastrozole), and Letrozole(Femara). For PCT purposes, our best choice is Aromasin as it is a steroidal AI and also a suicidal AI meaning that enzymes, after bonded, will become inactive and no longer be able to convert testosterone. We will use it at a moderate dose through our PCT. (25mg every day)


Human Chorionic Gonadotropin


HcG, simply put, has an alpha subunit amino chain that is identical to our bodies natural luteinizing hormone (LH) and follicle-stimulating hormone (FSH). These two hormones in the body are the “key players” in hormone secretion and also play a key role in sperm production in males. Simply, HcG will “act like” LH in the body, in turn making your testes begin to produce testosterone, which is the whole idea of PCT. But HcG is only a substitute for LH, just to “kick start” the testes into producing. We need to get our body to begin producing its own normal amount of sex hormones, which is what the next drug is for........


Selective estrogen receptor modulator(SERM)

A SERM is what will get our body to start spitting out that much needed luteinizing hormone. Now, there are two main serms that have been used over the years, and the arguement has raged on and on about which is better. They are Nolvadex(tamoxifen citrate) and Clomid(clomiphene citrate). Without going too much in depth, and after my many years of research, I have come to agreement with many other great minds such as William Llewellyn that Nolvadex is clearly superior for a few simple reasons. Please see my stickied thread to read Lywellyns entire article. It will also cover the basics of a SERM, saving me some time

Other Supplements to be used (optional but very beneficial)
• Creatine (fuels ATP)
• L-Carnitine (multiple benefits including sperm health)
• Vitamin B12 (PCT is a known time of lethargy and low appetite, B12 greatly improves this)
• IGF-1 (lr3) Multiple benefits including incredibly anabolic yet non-suppressive, will help muscle tissue continue to grow through PCT.

The suggested protocol
Please keep in mind that this may not be suited for cycles that exceed 18-24 weeks.

HcG- 1,500iu per week for weekk one and two. Split into three, 500iu doses MWF
Aromasin- 25mg/day (week 1+2), 12.5mg/day(weeks 3,4,5)
Nolvadex- 40mg/day (week 1+2+3) 20mg/day (week 4+5++)

Optional Additions (highly recommended)
15 grams of creatine every day (5 sometime in the morning, 10 post workout)
L-Carnitine- 500mg daily
Vitamin b12- I reccomend Synthetek’s Synthelamin, 2ml taken every 3-4 days. Synthelamin – Appetite Stimulator | Synthetek
IGF-1 Lr3- Dosing varies, experienced users only.

And there you have it, a simple and very effective PCT.

[PAiN]

Great post brother!

Keep them coming!

[rmkicks]

Indeed a great post. Thanks

[AllAboutPeptides]

Thanks! Let's hear everyone's personal favorite pct protocol.

[RockShawn]

Good read. I'm gonna incorporate the IGF1 lr3 into my pct.

My dr. prescribed Clomid though - should I Do both clomid and nolva (that's the broscience way ya know)

[pushiron]

Thank you for this information

[315 BEAST]

Great post bro

[bigpimpdaddy]

I always have so many people ask me this same question. While there is always a little different ways to go on Post-Cyle Therapy I think this post is good as any other I've seen or heard about.While this is a good starting point as to what does what. Simply put I have to tell the guys how to start on what dosage and how to end on such dosage. But in the end they are getting the just of why you need good post cycle drugs..
So thanks for posting this...

[AllAboutPeptides]

Good read. I'm gonna incorporate the IGF1 lr3 into my pct.

My dr. prescribed Clomid though - should I Do both clomid and nolva (that's the broscience way ya know)
A quote from William Llewellyn-

"I am not sure how Clomid and Nolvadex became so separated in the minds of bodybuilders. They certainly should not be. Clomid and Nolvadex are both anti-estrogens belonging to the same group of triphenylethylene compounds. They are structurally related and specifically classified as selective estrogen receptor modulators (SERMs) with mixed agonistic and antagonistic properties. This means that in certain tissues they can block the effects of estrogen, by altering the binding capacity of the receptor, while in others they can act as actual estrogens, activating the receptor. In men, both of these drugs act as anti-estrogens in their capacity to oppose the negative feedback of estrogens on the hypothalamus and stimulate the heightened release of GnRH (Gonadotropin Releasing Hormone). lh - leutenizing hormone - output by the pituitary will be increased as a result, which in turn can increase the level of testosterone by the testes. Both drugs do this, but for some reason bodybuilders persist in thinking that Clomid is the only drug good at stimulating testosterone. What you will find with a little investigation however is that not only is Nolvadex useful for the same purpose, it should actually be the preferred agent of the two.

[SIZE=2]Nolvadex is the more purely anti-estrogenic of the two drugs, at least where the hpta - hypothalamic-pituitary-testicular axis - (Hypothalamic-Pituitary-Testicular Axis) is concerned. This fact enables Nolvadex to offer the male bodybuilder certain advantages over Clomid. This is especially true at times when we are looking to restore a balanced hpta - hypothalamic-pituitary-testicular axis - , and would not want to desensitize the pituitary to GnRH. This could perhaps slow recovery to some extent, as the pituitary would require higher amounts of hypothalamic GnRH in the presence of Clomid in order to get the same level of lh - leutenizing hormone - stimulation."

Conclusion

I see no advantages to running both Clomid and Nolva together. However, if you feel the need to combine any two SERMs, I would suggest Nolva and Torem.

[bhcolex50x]

nice post

[AllAboutPeptides]

Update:
http://www.brotherhoodofpain.com/showthread.php?7651-The-future-of-PCT

[BIG_NICE]

Is HCG only considered necessary by most people on longer cycles? Just curious how many people notice a different or prefer using HCG. I've only ever used clomid and nolva. Wouldn't mind hearing some of u guys' opinions...

[grim]

Good read. I'm gonna incorporate the IGF1 lr3 into my pct.

My dr. prescribed Clomid though - should I Do both clomid and nolva (that's the broscience way ya know)
My doc did as well and it made me a gimp! BE CAREFUL!

[AllAboutPeptides]

Bump

[BIG_NICE]

Is HCG only considered necessary by most people on longer cycles? Just curious how many people notice a difference or prefer using HCG. I've only ever used clomid and nolva. Wouldn't mind hearing some of u guys' opinions...

nobody wants to share on this? I'd appreciate any responses.

[BIG_NICE]

i'd also be curious to see some more thoughts on the nolva and clomid together. Like Rockshawn said, it is the broscience way. Using both together seems widely accepted and encouraged as far as proper PCT protocol. How many use both? Anyone prefer just one?

[sonofJOR-EL]

It's amazing how most of the pct drugs r more dangerous then the juice itself

[grim]

Speaking from XP Clomid can cause strokes, its one of the sides.
Numerous ppl report mild stroke effects while on clomid w/o making the connection.
I was 1 of those idiots and 'slept it off'
6 strokes later, cheating death I am a gimp for life.
If you gonna use it please do yourself a favor and watch for signs, esp blurry vision!

[AllAboutPeptides]

Speaking from XP Clomid can cause strokes, its one of the sides.
Numerous ppl report mild stroke effects while on clomid w/o making the connection.
I was 1 of those idiots and 'slept it off'
6 strokes later, cheating death I am a gimp for life.
If you gonna use it please do yourself a favor and watch for signs, esp blurry vision!
This...

[BIG_NICE]

would you considering only running nolva for four weeks and leaving the clomid out totally?

[gearbox]

I've been doing this for years... That being said there is still a shit load out there that I don't know. I have learned the hard way how important PCT is to this whole process. It's nice to see this here so I can always come and reference it. It's a good one thanks bro

[PAiN]

This thread is full of awesome info. Stickied!


Keep it coming!

[Joker]

GOOD READ

[AllAboutPeptides]

Thank you for all your support brothers!

[martialartsman]

I've always just run clomid for 4 weeks but am now starting to wonder. Any help for a long time user wanting to come of for a break would be great so big BUMP.

[bbcoach]

This is some interesting info... thanks for posting

[vw4334]

Great info

[TheTrain]

Good read, very well put information in here

[Torres]

Very good post!!! I like nolvadex myself, I actually use it to stop any signs of gyno I might get when on my cycle and I have seen many people do good on it for PCT !!! Stock up on Nolvadex !! But also have Aromasin, Armidex, Caber ( just in case ) and Clomid, but Ive heard bad shit about that shit. I actually have alot of that on hand also, what to do with it !!!

[Thesuperwallaby]

I will be running nolva aromasin and possibly osta, for about 6 weeks

[MrAvg]

Nice sticky

[megaman11]

Great post man! Lot of good info. i needed to know!

[Getoffdeez]

Thanks for the info!

[Freakenstien]

just some thoughts for you all.. in the old days, guys used to just wean them selves off with no down time..
Andriol testocaps x 40mg doesn't shut down the pituitary gland. Even on a high dose, your nuts don't shrivel...
I know on the standard dose or 2 x 40mg caps per day, your fsh an LH levels remain fine..

So why aren't people using this method more? Why do people always revert to chemicals that can have sides..

This from an earlier poster "Speaking from XP Clomid can cause strokes, its one of the sides.
Numerous ppl report mild stroke effects while on clomid w/o making the connection.
I was 1 of those idiots and 'slept it off'
6 strokes later, cheating death I am a gimp for life.
If you gonna use it please do yourself a favor and watch for signs, esp blurry vision!"

Or perhaps a much milder pct using a combo of the above and other chemicals?

Any thoughts guys?

[PAiN]

just some thoughts for you all.. in the old days, guys used to just wean them selves off with no down time..
Andriol testocaps x 40mg doesn't shut down the pituitary gland. Even on a high dose, your nuts don't shrivel...
I know on the standard dose or 2 x 40mg caps per day, your fsh an LH levels remain fine..

So why aren't people using this method more? Why do people always revert to chemicals that can have sides..

This from an earlier poster "Speaking from XP Clomid can cause strokes, its one of the sides.
Numerous ppl report mild stroke effects while on clomid w/o making the connection.
I was 1 of those idiots and 'slept it off'
6 strokes later, cheating death I am a gimp for life.
If you gonna use it please do yourself a favor and watch for signs, esp blurry vision!"

Or perhaps a much milder pct using a combo of the above and other chemicals?

Any thoughts guys?

In the old days steroids were new and they didn't have access to the knowledge we do now. Weaning yourself off gear doesn't work. Whether your on 1000mg of test or 200mg of test you are shut down. Proper PCT with Clomid and NOLVA is the best thing to use to kick start your natural test levels again.

The guy that posted the Clomid info above is a worthless idiot that's why he was banned he doesn't even train.

You are over thinking everything here. In one thread you said you ran deca alone and it gave you no sides, then another thread you said it screwed up your test levels. Quit over thinking this stuff bro we have been doing this forever.

[Freakenstien]

In the old days steroids were new and they didn't have access to the knowledge we do now. Weaning yourself off gear doesn't work. Whether your on 1000mg of test or 200mg of test you are shut down. Proper PCT with Clomid and NOLVA is the best thing to use to kick start your natural test levels again.

The guy that posted the Clomid info above is a worthless idiot that's why he was banned he doesn't even train.

You are over thinking everything here. In one thread you said you ran deca alone and it gave you no sides, then another thread you said it screwed up your test levels. Quit over thinking this stuff bro we have been doing this forever.

haha ok fair comments... and yes, Im undecided but leaning towards it scewing up my test.. I didn't crash when I came off. I would have remembered that but I seem to have been lethargic for years, and probably from around the time I took the decca.. was putting two and two together about decca causing issues with lethargy..


Weaning ones self off, I did it when I had been on trt for years, and it worked.. But saying that, I don't think it worked properly as lethargy worse I think and test levels not back to normal.. So ok Pain.. point taken....

Some times I really need to chew things over and get them drummed in to my head to make em stick... Appreciate your comments and advice.. cheers mate.

[Docmdnite]

So I already have Low T, before using anything. I cruise at 400mg/week with test enanthate.

After a cycle should I continue with that dose.

If I do continue, how does that affect my pct in terms of what to use and what to leave out, if anything?

[roomy]

very useful post for beginners, thank you

[BUCK21]

Great info, definitely going to change up my next PCT

[gene1976ny]

Great post brother!

Keep them coming!
good read

[Ken79]

Good info thanks for the post

[ericksonalbert]

How-to Post Cycle Therapy


Everything you need to know


http://i1352.photobucket.com/albums/q648/allaboutpeptides/PostCycleTherapy_zps76e78f50.jpg



Post cycle therapy is the period of time after your cycle is over in which the main goal is to restore your bodiless natural functions including normal and natural hormone levels. This is done through a few different drugs.




Aromatase Inhibitor


First we need an AI to avoid any amortizing estrogen that may come from the esters that are still clearing and also from the HcG we will be taking the first two weeks of the PCT. This will keep your estrogen levels in check while also helping restore your natural testosterone levels. Some popular AI’s are: Aromasin(exemestane), Arimidex(anastrozole), and Letrozole(Femara). For PCT purposes, our best choice is Aromasin as it is a steroidal AI and also a suicidal AI meaning that enzymes, after bonded, will become inactive and no longer be able to convert testosterone. We will use it at a moderate dose through our PCT. (25mg every day)


Human Chorionic Gonadotropin


HcG, simply put, has an alpha subunit amino chain that is identical to our bodies natural luteinizing hormone (LH) and follicle-stimulating hormone (FSH). These two hormones in the body are the “key players” in hormone secretion and also play a key role in sperm production in males. Simply, HcG will “act like” LH in the body, in turn making your testes begin to produce testosterone, which is the whole idea of PCT. But HcG is only a substitute for LH, just to “kick start” the testes into producing. We need to get our body to begin producing its own normal amount of sex hormones, which is what the next drug is for........


Selective estrogen receptor modulator(SERM)

A SERM is what will get our body to start spitting out that much needed luteinizing hormone. Now, there are two main serms that have been used over the years, and the arguement has raged on and on about which is better. They are Nolvadex(tamoxifen citrate) and Clomid(clomiphene citrate). Without going too much in depth, and after my many years of research, I have come to agreement with many other great minds such as William Llewellyn that Nolvadex is clearly superior for a few simple reasons. Please see my stickied thread to read Lywellyns entire article. It will also cover the basics of a SERM, saving me some time

Other Supplements to be used (optional but very beneficial)
• Creatine (fuels ATP)
• L-Carnitine (multiple benefits including sperm health)
• Vitamin B12 (PCT is a known time of lethargy and low appetite, B12 greatly improves this)
• IGF-1 (lr3) Multiple benefits including incredibly anabolic yet non-suppressive, will help muscle tissue continue to grow through PCT.

The suggested protocol
Please keep in mind that this may not be suited for cycles that exceed 18-24 weeks.

HcG- 1,500iu per week for weekk one and two. Split into three, 500iu doses MWF
Aromasin- 25mg/day (week 1+2), 12.5mg/day(weeks 3,4,5)
Nolvadex- 40mg/day (week 1+2+3) 20mg/day (week 4+5++)

Optional Additions (highly recommended)
15 grams of creatine every day (5 sometime in the morning, 10 post workout)
L-Carnitine- 500mg daily
Vitamin b12- I reccomend Synthetek’s Synthelamin, 2ml taken every 3-4 days. Synthelamin – Appetite Stimulator | Synthetek
IGF-1 Lr3- Dosing varies, experienced users only.

And there you have it, a simple and very effective PCT.



My question is this, how long after my last injection would I start my PCT? I just did an 8 week cycle of Test p, Mast p and tren a. 1 cc of each EOD

[mightymoose29]

Very informational I always thought Clomid nolvadex but I'll defiantly will b using the hcg next time thanx

[Trappie_Chan]

I've been doing aromasin 12.5 eod and I'm almost done with pct. Is this enough? Also considering extending to a 5th weeks of nolva at 10mg ed.

[PAiN]

I've been doing aromasin 12.5 eod and I'm almost done with pct. Is this enough? Also considering extending to a 5th weeks of nolva at 10mg ed.

No! Go read some other stickies in the post cycle therapy forum bro. An AI only makes sure you don't have estrogenic sides. Nolva won't do much alone either. Post Cycle Therapy should be Nolva and Clomid for 4 - 6 weeks sometimes longer depending on the cycle. You have to have something that will restart your natural test production and you do not. Your entire cycle is about to be a waste once your fully shut down for the next few months or years. You better grab clomid and Nolva immediately!

[Trappie_Chan]

No! Go read some other stickies in the post cycle therapy forum bro. An AI only makes sure you don't have estrogenic sides. Nolva won't do much alone either. Post Cycle Therapy should be Nolva and Clomid for 4 - 6 weeks sometimes longer depending on the cycle. You have to have something that will restart your natural test production and you do not. Your entire cycle is about to be a waste once your fully shut down for the next few months or years. You better grab clomid and Nolva immediately!

So you're saying I NEED Clomid? I am running both nolva (40/40/20/20) and aromasin (12.5 eod) for 4 or 5 weeks. Also didn't think I needed hcg as I was just running test e 500mg/10wks.

[PAiN]

So you're saying I NEED Clomid? I am running both nolva (40/40/20/20) and aromasin (12.5 eod) for 4 or 5 weeks. Also didn't think I needed hcg as I was just running test e 500mg/10wks.

No hcg. And yes you need Clomid. Nolva alone is old school and now we know it doesn't do much alone. Nothing like what Clomid does. Grab some asap.

[Trappie_Chan]

No hcg. And yes you need Clomid. Nolva alone is old school and now we know it doesn't do much alone. Nothing like what Clomid does. Grab some asap.

Any labs on here that use PayPal? I was thinking about stocking up on tbol anyway.

[T-Bagger]

Is HCG absolutely essential to my nuts functioning again, or will Nolva & Clomid suffice?

[thepeopleschamp]

Anyone know where I can find reviews and or reputable sources for research Chem?

[Flexington535V]

Awesome, really appreciate this information!

[Jay Cuthler]

Due to your post I understand what is pct and right way to use them. 3 month ago I started my first cycle and buy some nolva and clomid for pct from steroidsfax.com. So I have no problem with my health, but it was so scary to take first cycle))

[Sqwuidd]

Great read.

I am running HCG during my cycle -- 250 2x per week. I have NOLVA , CLOM and ADEX as well --Running the Adex 1mg twice per week on cycle.

Gonna do the NOLVA and CLOM for PCT starting 4 days after last pin ( I am running all short esters). Prob do the recommended 40mg Nolva and 60 Clom for the first week.

3 questions for anyone's input--

I am doing HCG on cycle 250 2x per week -- Should I also run it before starting PCT?

Should I take .5 ADEX EOD for first 2 weeks during my PCT phase. ?

I plan on doing a TEST CYP cruise at about 250mgs per week between this cycle and next one (Probably in August) -- Should I even run the PCT? or jump into the cruise after this cyc is over. Current cyc-- 150TRENA,100TESTP 100MASTA - 1cc EOD for about 10 weeks. Oral winny/anavar included as well.


Thanks bros.

[Alphadog28]

Def going to throw in igf1 lr3 into my next pct

[meatneck71]

Great read.

I am running HCG during my cycle -- 250 2x per week. I have NOLVA , CLOM and ADEX as well --Running the Adex 1mg twice per week on cycle.

Gonna do the NOLVA and CLOM for PCT starting 4 days after last pin ( I am running all short esters). Prob do the recommended 40mg Nolva and 60 Clom for the first week.

3 questions for anyone's input--

I am doing HCG on cycle 250 2x per week -- Should I also run it before starting PCT?

Should I take .5 ADEX EOD for first 2 weeks during my PCT phase. ?

I plan on doing a TEST CYP cruise at about 250mgs per week between this cycle and next one (Probably in August) -- Should I even run the PCT? or jump into the cruise after this cyc is over. Current cyc-- 150TRENA,100TESTP 100MASTA - 1cc EOD for about 10 weeks. Oral winny/anavar included as well.


Thanks bros.

I have been reading that it actually IS better to run HCG during your cycle and not so much afterwards. The point that some of the articles that I have read is that HCG will keep you from shutting down and that's what you want to avoid all together. Some will also say that you don't want to burn out your receptors from HCG if you run it too long afterwards as well. Are you finding that 250ius twice a week is sufficient for you? I'm planning on running HCG during my next cycle. My last one (test only) shut me down hard for over a month.

[Doughboy72]

Great! Thanks!

[5millionbucks]

what about the triptorelin protocol; even doing hcg on cycle then shooting 100 mcg triptorelin a week or 2 after your last shot of HCG/anabolics; doing nolva/clomid have alot of people feeling like shit and then when they come off those it makes shit worse. Alot of people tell me that "PCT" was technically just a bridge to your next cycle; but what if you want to come off for 6 months to a few years or say you want to have kids again. Any1 try the triptorelin protocol; I know theres dangers of castration but 100mcg after your cycle; I wouldn't think its too much of a big deal.

[Kingslate]

thank you sir

[MR.PUMP]

What a great informative post! Good job!

[Aceof]

Question, I've read that taking HCG from the onset and through one's cycle that it helps the PCT process and your balls stay somewhat normal while taking test. I.e. your body is still making it's amount of testosterone, or at least trying to. Is there any merit to this?

[ragnarok88]

Great post, thanks!

[Jayjaylooksup]

Great detail. Thanks

[jimbosmith316]

Good stuff!

[Brock74]

This really will help me out. I have everything on hand for PCT but did not know how to go about it properly. Thanks for your post!

[Plaiute]

thanks for the info nice read

[spoolin]

Great post brother!

Keep them coming!

Hey Pain, in a post further through this thread, you state that both Clomid and Nolva are needed and Nolva alone was old school, but you also agree with this threads initial PCT protocol that only runs Nolva. Can you help elaborate on this for us? Is this PCT protocol with HCG and Nolva sufficient or do we need Clomid also? I'm a bit confused here.

Thanks

[Ray68]

High quality post. Thank you.

[Topher]

I am 4 weeks out from PCT and reading this helped a lot thank you.

[Bh1988]

Definitely didn't know all of this info before. Will help with my next cycle

[Juicepuppy]

great information